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Post by Rockyraccoon on Apr 3, 2004 23:28:08 GMT -5
Hello ETFFF members and guest! As most of you may or may not know...this message board is a free service funded by the little add links you see above us. Now I usually don't even pay these adds any attention at all...but for some reason I happend to check them out this evening. From what I've seen they usually shuffle them around with new ones coming a long every so often. But tonight I found one to www.theflyguys.net and I was outragged to see it on our board! The fly guys have an incredible web site...which includes 1000's of fly patterns at prices close to .42 cents per fly for bulk orders. But here's the point of my story. Fly Drifters ordered up about 200 or something dozen back last September. The blanace due of over $1600 was paid promptly and we have returned checks to prove that. Well...we waited, and waited, and waited some more. Finally out of curiousity I sent them an email. This was in December and there response was that they were working on our order. So we waited some more...and more... and more. My next email to them was near the end of January. Now there response was that they'd actually lost our order in their paperwork and had no proof that the order ever existed. Well after some not so friendly emails and the fact that we had our cancelled checks...they made up a story that our flies had been shipped...but returned two weeks later in a very damaged state...and low and behold they claimed their mail boy failed to get insurance on it. So now it's a hard luck story for them because they would have to redo our entire order for the same price. Well...we've had several other emailing spats with them since then. We still have not recieved the flies, nor will they refund our money. It goes without saying that I personally think they are crooks and would recomommend against purchasing anything from them. Since all this happend...we've done some investigating over the internet and around the southeast...and we've encountered many folks with the same story about the Fly Guys. This list includes Cal at CR Outfitters, HB from Clinch River House, and countless smaller victims! Just be careful if you do click on any of the add links and know in advance that ETFFF does not pick what adds go there and therefore have no control over the business ethics of said business.
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Post by Flyman on Apr 4, 2004 2:08:40 GMT -5
I've also heard a lot of bad stuff abot them. I remember a couple months ago on FOAL someone said something about them. Well boy it was on then. People came out of the woodwork saying how they had been ripped off by them. Some on large orders just like yours .I can't believe they can stay in business. I hate people like that I know it's all you can do to keep from going up there. I think at this point I'd call the attorneys general for TN and see if I couldn't get some help. The AG help won't cost you a dime. I know most are tuff on interstate fraud. They may also be guilty of mail fraud. Which is a federal offense. If nothing else maybe they can prevent them from doing it to someone else.
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Grumpy
South Holston Wild Brown
Posts: 103
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Post by Grumpy on Apr 4, 2004 7:03:16 GMT -5
That was a level headed suggestion by Flyman, personally, i'd want to take a road trip with a can of gas Rocky, i hate credit cards, in this case though, it would have worked out better. Checkout your PM. Grumpy
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Post by racerx on Apr 4, 2004 14:09:57 GMT -5
It's all I can do not to go up there and stick 160 dozen flies into these a-holes Grumpy (I think that would be proper justice myself.) I would have paid by credit card (always do because they take care of fraud) but they were having trouble with pay pal at the time. I'll get these crooks one day!
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Post by Riverman on Apr 4, 2004 17:11:23 GMT -5
Racer, Just invite them for a free day of fishing on the Hi. or Clinch and when they ask...... what`s the chains and concrete blocks for? Just tell em,, thats what us good ole boy`s use for anchors ;D. Just make sure them chains are tight sooo`s they dont escape .
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Post by joshbarnett on Apr 4, 2004 19:15:51 GMT -5
Michael, Rusty:
You still haven't gotten them? Heck, I can remember standing on the patio of the condo back in January listening to stories about them not sending them. I like FlyMan's advice as well.
Joshua Barnett
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Post by Flyman on Apr 4, 2004 19:51:52 GMT -5
Oh......no! I thought they were in the US. I didn't know they were Canadian. Grump's idea is sounding better all the time
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Grumpy
South Holston Wild Brown
Posts: 103
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Post by Grumpy on Apr 5, 2004 7:14:36 GMT -5
I'd contact them & tell them that you were going to blast them on every website you visit also. That is a public service, not slander. Grumpy
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Owl
South Holston Wild Brown
" What are you laughin' at?"
Posts: 103
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Post by Owl on Apr 5, 2004 11:42:20 GMT -5
I think they've already been burned all over the net. I don't really know how they stay around so much...looks like someone would have sued them by now or something??? What do I know. Owl
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Post by Petey on Apr 5, 2004 11:46:02 GMT -5
Owl, I am with you. I think all of the people that have been burned ought to get together for this one cause. Hire a Lawyer together and go after them with a suit. Now with them being Cananda I don't know what international laws mandate. But I can't believe these guys can get away with stealing thousands of dollars from people and get away with it! Petey
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Post by Rodonthefly on Apr 5, 2004 14:35:43 GMT -5
Hey guys sounds like you all got the short end of the stick on that deal. I'll tell you there' s another web site called BlueFlyCafe.com. Although the flys cost anywhere from .60- 65 cents they offer free shiping on any order over 20 bucks. I have ordered from there and have been really happy.
Tight Lines Rodney
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Post by tennswede on Apr 7, 2004 14:50:35 GMT -5
I have had nice experience with percys flies (L.L.COTE out of Errol N.H. as well as flydealer.com.
Rocky! I talked to an attorney who is teaching at the school I'm attending and she suggested TN Attorney general or even a private attorney practicing in consumer law. I'm a paralegal student and I'm not a lawyer and can therefore not give legal advice, but I don know that this internet transaction is very difficult to litigate because you have to find a court that has jurisdiction over the seller. If they don't have an office or physical presence or any other kind of ties to TN, I would say that TN doesn't have jurisdiction of the seller. I'm afraid the only way to get the money back is to sue in the home province in Canada at their local level, because I know that even if a TN court could have jurisdiction over an Internet seller in Canada, they will most likely not be able to enforce the judgement. I'm soory you had this bad experience. DISCLAIMER This message is not constituting legal advice, since I' am not a lawyer.
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Post by russ on Apr 12, 2004 9:09:21 GMT -5
Contact the Better Buisness Bureau. i had a similar problem with a watch that i sent off for repair. The company sent me a letter stating that they had recieved the watch, but I waited for months and never heard anything from them agian. I finally found out that the internet address for the company was no longer in service. The company was still going, but the internet part of it had closed. I tried to get my watch back from them, but they said that they had no records from their internet company anymore. I called the better buisness bureau, they must have contacted the company, because with-in a week i recieved a phone call from the president of the company saying that they were sending me a brand new updated watch and some coupons for other watches and junk!
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Post by biggatrout on Apr 13, 2004 14:48:36 GMT -5
Rockey / Rusty
Being in the retail business we see check come back bad from time to time. Not the case with you but we know how to deal with them. Every $500 is a felony, at $1600 this company has commited two. Just like when a person writes a check they are accountable for it, it also works backwards fot a business. If this were my check I would find out if the business you are talking about is incorporated, if not find out who is responsible for it. That person is solely responsible for that business, go to your court house and file a complaint against the person and the business. At this point you do not want the goods and make a demand for the return of your money.
On a side note again being in the retail business, we have seen a lot of people buying electronics on the internet. As a friend of you guys I can say do not buy anything big purchase from someone you dont know on the internet. YOU WILL GET BURNED. In every situation I have seen the purchaser did not get the full package of what they ordered.
Bigga....
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Post by obtuseangler on Apr 13, 2004 16:15:53 GMT -5
I don't think civil litigation is the way you want to go on this. Your chances of actually accomplishing anything that way are very slim. You probably wouldn't even find a lawyer interested in taking that case because they'll all judge the odds of actually collecting anything as being so low as to make a civil case financially untenable. In other words, I think a civil case would be chasing good money after bad and I think any other lawyer would feel that way and therefore not take the case.
Have you considered seeing your local DAG or the Postal Inspectors? The local guy might be unable to handle an international case like this, but I as a prosecutor would certainly give serious consideration to treating this as a felony theft by deception (that's Alabama law, of course, but I imagine you have something similar in TN). Even if the local guy can't handle it, he certainly could lobby the postal inspectors for you. It's my experience that you have to light a fire under their butts before they'll move on anything. "Bigger fish to fry" is the usual response with them, but these fish sound pretty big--they've evidently ripped off people in multiple states.
But TN courts almost certainly do have jurisdiction over them if they willfully availed themselves of business opportunities in TN by soliciting you to mail a check from there. That should be a sufficient contact with the state and your dispute with them is about as related to that contact as you can get, so you probably could sue them if you chose that route.
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